Ramin Jahanbegloo, 56, is a renowned Iranian-Canadian philosopher and political activist with a doctorate in philosophy from Sorbonne University, France. A professor of political science and a research fellow in the Centre for Ethics at University of Toronto, he has been dealing with ideas of non-violence and political philosophy. Currently in India to speak on the Global Gandhian movement, Jahanbegloo talks to The Times of India about how he has been actively involved with Gandhian ideologies and practices and why he wishes to create a global movement on the same.
Tell us a little about yourself.
I was born in Tehran and lived in France for nearly 20 years where my contact with India started. I was always interested and attracted to India. It wasn't as a tourist or in any romantic way. My parents always had contacts with Indian diplomats in Iran and also when we were in France. I came to India in 1989, when I had already started working on Gandhi. I lived in Delhi for two years. I've written nine books in India; six are conversations with eminent Indians.
What really drew you towards Gandhi?
A: I started with Gandhi because most of the famous philosophers -- Hegel, Marx and Nietzsche -- that I had studied and worked on when I was doing my PhD at Sorbonne University, admitted to violence and war as a crucial principle in history which did not appeal to me. When I started my PhD I was very keen on getting involved with the philosophy of nonviolence, which brought me to study Gandhi and look into the western intellectual foundations of Gandhi like Ruskin, Tolstoy etc. For me, non-violence has two aspects which are the philosophical and the activist aspect.
What directed you towards philosophy?
A: I decided to study philosophy because of the main question that is asked by humanity which is why there is 'being' rather than 'non-being'? I will add another question to it now because of the work on violence I have done: Why do we have violence rather than non-violence? I think the main foundation of philosophical being brought me to a second ethical question: why are human beings so violent? Who are the authors and thinkers who have confronted this violence politically, socially and philosophically? After Jesus Christ, Buddha and St Francis, the name of Gandhi comes first in the 21st century as a propagator of non-violence.
Do you believe that violence can be eliminated form society completely?
No and yes. Well you see, we have to distinguish between aggression and violence in a society. That is why we think that animals and humans can both be violent because it is inherent in our nature. However, human violence is learned socially and politically, more than being an instinct.
The violence that we use is not comparable with the aggressive instinct of animals. Animals do not construct concentration camps, they not organise mass killings. And they do not go into a school and kill innocent children. Their fear is conditioned. Human beings are actually 'sick animals'. The solution to eliminate violence from society is, hence, historical, social and political rather than psychological. For example, the rapes that happen in Delhi are because of poverty, under education, bad social situation of people. The solution lies in going to the roots and attacking them, fighting the social and political evils and importantly through education rather than hanging these people. As Gandhi as well as Martin Luther King said, you have to fight the murder not the murderer. By killing the murderer, nothing can change.
Tell us something about 'Global Gandhian Movement,' the topic that you often speak on.
Gandhi has influenced not just India but the world. The Gandhian mode of thinking has a much deeper impact than people may believe. People like Mandela, Martin Luther King, Aung Sang Suu Kyi and Dalai Lama have been directly influenced by Gandhi. But students in Egypt, Serbia, Tunisia, have been indirectly influenced by him. A global Gandhian movement is prevalent in society. Most importantly, the Gandhian method of politics is the extension of ethical ideas. People are not fighting just for change of power. They are fighting for something more than power. I will be highlighting how youth are fighting to change the social ills of society and struggling with all the ethical wrong doings.
What is this 'power' that people are fighting for?
We must distinguish between political power and empowerment of society. I mean it is the empowerment of civil society rather than state related power that the Gandhian movement consists of. For Gandhi, active citizenship and enlargement of pluralism was much more important than state oriented politics. Gandhi was also a listener. He listened to Muslims, Sikhs, Hindus, Parsis and then inculcated it and acted accordingly. Others did not have the capacity of listening, and did not succeed as well as Gandhi because they inculcated their ideologies before really listening to the masses. They do not leave behind the same legacy, for example, Jinnah. So fighting for sovereignty and empowerment of civil society is more important than political power.
Does ancient Indian philosophy interest you?
Of course! I've been very inspired by Buddhism. I've read a lot about Vivekananda, and many other spiritual thinkers. I'm very interested in Tagore. I wrote a book on Tagore! He is my second favourite person after Gandhi. Tagore for me is very close to the Persian culture. I always say, either I was an Indian in my previous life or I will be an Indian in my next life! Persian culture has always been inter-twined in the Indian context. Hence I have always been very close to India. I've read a lot of Sarojini Naidu as a poet. I've even read B.R Amedkar and I've done critiques by him on Gandhi. I like the intercultural, diversity of India. In fact the very idea of non-violence is diversity. It is essentially solidarity of difference.
Do you have a favourite book or author?
One would definitely be Gandhi's autobiography. A book by Arthur Schopenhauer, The World as Will and Representation. Leo Tolstoy's 'War and Peace' is a book I love and always keep going back. Finally, Magic mountain by Thomas Mann. I'm actually choosing a few books from each civilization and combining it to give me a wholesome experience for my life.
You were imprisoned by the Iranian government for nearly four months. How did it affect your life?
I went to prison because I'm a non-violent activist, and I believe in non-violent changes in Iran. But I believe the Iranian government imprisoned me because I had become too popular in Iran and the regime did not like me very much. Solitary confinement isn't the best thing, and it affected me a lot. I think I became even more devoted to nonviolent thinking. I think it was because I read Gandhi's autobiography over and over again while in prison because it was the only book that I was allowed to keep. When I came out of prison, I decided that I want to fight against the spirit of revenge. I think to fight against the evil is to fight the evil itself. The question that was always on my mind like I have seen with Nazis, or Stalinism or colonialism: Why do some humans suppress or disrespect other humans to feel that they are somehow superior? I needed to understand why this evil was prevalent and I had to understand the very reason for it.
Apart from being a philosopher and a teacher, do you have any other hobbies that you engage in?
I have a lot of hobbies. I love classical movies. I am a film critic. I will probably write book in the next few years on Satyajit Ray. I went to Kolkata and met his son, as I was very inspired by his works. I love his cinema. But I'm truly a fan of classical cinema, the 1930's-40's. My favourite actors are Spencer Tracy and James Cagney. I watch 1-2 classical movies every day. I sleep only 4-5 hours, so I make it a point to watch movies at night. I enjoy classical music too.
Apart from Gandhi, who do you draw inspiration from?
One living person who has inspired me and been very close to is Dalai Lama. He is the living expression of Gandhi. I make it a point to visit him every time that I am in India. For me, he is a symbol of peace and tolerance and Ahimsa.
Human beings are actually 'sick animals': Iranian-Canadian philosopher
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Human beings are actually 'sick animals': Iranian-Canadian philosopher
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Human beings are actually 'sick animals': Iranian-Canadian philosopher
